Report of the 19th Plenary Meeting

September 2000, London, UK

Location and programme

List of those present

1. OPENING OF THE MEETING

The Chairman welcomed members to the 19^th plenary meeting of ISO/TC 92 and thanked BSI for providing meeting facilities for the week.

The Chairman invited leaders of the delegations and liaison members to introduce themselves.

The agenda in document N 885/Rev was approved.

It was agreed that the drafting committee would consist of the Secretary and Mr Rutman.

The report of the 18^th meeting of ISO/TC 92, held on 17 and 21 May 1999 in Berlin, (document N 877) was approved.

The Secretary introduced the report of the Secretariat in document N 899, which contained the current list of participating, observing and liaison members of ISO/TC 92. She informed members that further information about the structure, objectives and the current work programme of all the sub-committees could be found on the ISO server at www.iso.ch, and also in the ISO/TC 92 Business Plan (N 890).

6.1 Confirmation of the Chairman of ISO/TC 92

The Chairman said that his term of office was due to expire at the end of this year and that he wished to continue for a further period of three years. Members unanimously agreed to re-appoint Prof. Cox as the Chairman of ISO/TC 92 until 2003-09, subject to approval by ISO Technical Management Board.

6.2 Chairman and Secretariat of ISO/TC 92/SC 3

The Chairman reported that a new Chairman and Secretary of SC 3 had been appointed through a postal resolution in document N 884 and the result of the ballot had been circulated in document N 889. The Chairman welcomed Dr Gann as the new Chairman and Dr Hartzell as the new Secretary of SC 3.

The Chairman thanked Mr Roux for his long and outstanding service to ISO/TC 92 and presented him with a plaque, expressing members' appreciation for his input to the work of the TC. Mr Roux had chaired SC 3 since 1985 and had led the review of ISO/TC 92 in Groupe des Sages, which had helped to re-focus the TC and led to the approval of new scopes for all SCs in May 1999.

6.3 ISO Server

The Secretary referred to document N 894, which contained the 'User Guide to the ISO TC Server', and explained that ISO Central Secretariat had created web sites for all its TCs and the work of the TCs would be conducted via the internet in the near future. All those who had registered for the London meeting had been registered with ISO and given a log-in name, as listed in document N 888. This would be revised following this meeting to include all the participants and would be circulated with the report. All the TC 92 documents available in the electronic format would be posted on the TC 92 web site and would be available to the registered members.

The Secretary gave a brief presentation, explaining how to use the ISO Server (Annex D). Only the folder containing general information would be publicly available; other folders containing information about meetings, minutes and resolutions, documents for comment and project folders would only be available to registered users. The ISO Server was an interactive system, which would allow not only viewing and printing documents, but also submitting comments, revising documents (for authorised members only) and registering for meetings. Separate folders would be created for WGs, which would be run by the conveners.

The Secretary also drew members' attention to the Standards Developers' Information Site (SDIS), which was available on the ISO web site (www.iso.ch) and contained a lot of useful information. This included basic ISO procedures and directives, ISO templates and guidance on writing standards.

6.4 ISO President's Conference (N 893)

The Chairman presented his report from the ISO President's Conference, held in June 2000 in Geneva. The main purpose of the Conference had been to introduce the new ISO management strategies to the TC and SC Chairmen. The Conference had been well attended, with over 200 participants representing 134 ISO TCs. The importance of ISO members adopting International Standards was particularly emphasised. All the presentations were available on the ISO web site.

The Chairman introduced his revised document on the framework for the long-term future of fire safety and gave a brief presentation, outlining the main proposals in his paper (N 909). The Chairman was asked to give examples of standards for the proposed three levels. He explained that level 1 standards would establish the "standard for standards", providing the overall philosophy and the principles for tests, and would model all the relevant physical and chemical processes - there was currently no example of this type of standard. Level 2 standards would be directed at specific aspects of performance and what should me measured, and would relate to fire scenarios and design fires. Level 3 standards would be detailed, working standards - the cone calorimeter was an example of this level. Level 1 and 2 would establish a framework for level 3 standards. The existing prescriptive tests would not fit into this new system, but ISO/TC 92 would maintain and develop them further for as long as they were required.

The Chairman suggested that these proposals should be developed further by a new Task Group. It was agreed to establish TG 244, with Dr Alpert as convener, to develop further the framework document and to prepare drafts of the level 1, 2 and 3 standards for discussion at the next meeting. Sub-committees were invited to nominate up to 2 representatives to participate in this work.

In the absence of the convener, the Chairman introduced the report from WG 8 (N 897). It was noted that ISO 13943 - 'Fire safety - Vocabulary' had been published earlier this year and that WG 8 wished to begin preliminary work on a new document, covering more fire-related terms. The first draft would be provided by the UK by March 2002.

Concern was expressed about the lack of participation in WG 8, with very few members attending the meetings. It was suggested that the sub-committees should inform WG 8 about any work on fire terms, such as SC 1 currently reviewing all the definitions in its published standards.

The proposal to begin preliminary work on a new document, covering more fire terms, was approved. It was agreed that the TC 92 sub-committees and the committees (ISO and IEC) in liaison with TC 92 would be invited to participate in the work of WG 8.

The Chairman introduced the report from TPMG in document N 898. TPMG had met three times since the last TC 92 meeting and had considered 40 new work item proposals. Other issues, such as the ISO/TC 92 Business Plan and the framework document, had also been discussed by TPMG prior to circulation to the committee. TPMG had endorsed the new structure of SC 4 and had discussed the operation of the Vienna Agreement and liaison issues.

9.1 Review of TPMG procedures (N 895)

As agreed at the Berlin meeting, members were invited to comment on the operation of TPMG. The Chairman said that the system was working effectively and each new work item proposal had been discussed and the appropriate recommendation had been sent to the relevant sub-committee. In a number of cases peer review or additional input had been requested before a TPMG view could be expressed.

It was confirmed that TPMG had an advisory role in reviewing new work item proposals. The TPMG recommendations were either circulated with the new work item ballots or discussed at meetings, but the ultimate decision as to whether to proceed with the work item was made by the sub-committee.

It was suggested that the name of WG 11 should be changed to 'Technical Programme Advisory Group' to reflect its advisory role in terms of reviewing new work item proposals. However, the Chairman pointed out that WG 11 also had a management and co-ordination role and it would not be appropriate to change its title. It was agreed to amend the operating procedures in N 895, replacing the word 'approve' with 'review' in relation to new work item proposals.

Concern was expressed about the lack of transparency of TPMG and it was suggested that reports of TPMG meetings should be available to members on the TC 92 web site. This was agreed.

9.2 Operation of the Vienna Agreement

The Chairman reported that concern had been expressed by some non-European members of ISO about the operation of the Vienna Agreement, and in particular about the lack of participation at working level for the items with CEN lead. In some cases CEN committees had taken ISO standards and developed them into EN ISO standards, but with no participation of non-European members, whose only input had been the vote in dual ballot. The work of SC 2 had been delayed by the equivalent European Standards being developed in CEN/TC 127.

The Secretary said that SC 1 had four items under the Vienna Agreement with CEN/TC 127, with CEN lead. She had requested participation of two non-European members of SC 1 in the special meetings of CEN/TC 127, at which the comments received in CEN Enquiry (equivalent to DIS) had been discussed. These two representatives had presented SC 1 comments in addition to national comments. However, no non-European representatives had been involved in the development of the documents pre-Enquiry stage.

The Chairman said that the operation of the Vienna Agreement was due to be discussed at the meeting of the CEN/ISO Joint Co-ordination Group on 26 September. The Secretary agreed to find out more about this Group and to circulate the outcome of that meeting.

Secretary's note: The Co-ordination Group is an informal body, normally meeting alongside the CEN Technical Board or ISO Technical Management Board meetings, and any issues common to both standardisation bodies are discussed. Please see Annex B to this report for the resolution agreed by ISO TMB in September. This allows for automatic participation of up to four non-European members in the development of items under the Vienna Agreement. The resolution still needs to be approved by CEN Technical Board, which is due to meet in November.

Prof. Purser introduced his report from WG 12 in document N 906. He reported that the FTIR issue had now been resolved and WG 12 had suggested a number of other areas in which it could become involved. Members considered these proposals and it was agreed that WG 12 should be disbanded. Members thanked Dr Purser for his work in convening WG 12.

Dr Sundstrom introduced the SC 1 report in document N 900. SC 1 was making good progress, with four documents out on DIS ballot and five new work item proposals on NWI ballot. TG 6 was reviewing all the published SC 1 standards and technical reports, and assessing their suitability for FSE. The outcome of this work would be submitted to SC 4 in due course. SC 1 was also looking at the terms and definitions in their published standards and would try to rationalise them. The resulting definitions would be submitted to WG 8. The Chairman thanked SC 1 members for their work.

Mr Priest reported on progress in SC 2, as outlined in document N 901. He pointed out that China was a P-member, not an O-member, as stated in the report. Mr Priest said that a number of work items had been recently deleted by ISO CS, but they were all being reinstated and would be progressed as planned. ISO 834-1 and four standards for loadbearing elements had been published this year.

Mr Morris had retired as the convener of WG 6 and had been replaced by Mr Nicholas.

A new WG had been established, with Mr Jackman as convener, to look at the existing fire resistance standards and assess their use for FSE, and also at the type of data needed for FSE. The Chairman thanked SC 2 members for their efforts.

Dr Gann, the new Chairman of SC 3, reported on the progress in the sub-committee. He thanked

Dr Hartzell, the new Secretary of SC3, for his efforts in organising the work of the SC. Dr Gann also thanked Ms Di Carlo for her advice and help during the hand-over period. SC 3 had began developing seven new work items, approved earlier this year. Also, the sub-committee had acknowledged the need for close liaison with SC 1 on the FTIR item at its meeting.

The Chairman welcomed the new Chairman and Secretary of SC 3 and thanked the sub-committee members for their work.

Dr Kruppa introduced the report from SC 4 in document N 903. He pointed out that the title of WG 10 was 'Fire risk assessment'. Dr Kruppa reported that SC 4 was making good progress with all its new work items and first committee drafts were expected in March 2001. SC 4/WG 8 had held a joint meeting with representatives of all the sub-committees on the data needed for FSE in addition to its regular meeting. It was agreed that a workshop on this subject would be held during the next round of meetings of TC 92 in March 2002.

The Chairman thanked SC 4 members for their work.

15.1 IEC/TC 89 Fire hazard testing (N 891)

Mr Hoover presented his report in N 891. He reported that IEC was setting up a web site similar to the ISO server. IEC/TC 89 had held its last meeting in October 1999 in Kyoto and its detailed work programme was included in N 891.

15.2 CIB W14: Fire (N 896)

Prof. Kokkala introduced his report in document N 896. This was noted. The Chairman thanked Prof. Kokkala for providing peer review on a TC 92 new work item proposal.

15.3 International Maritime Organisation (N 904)

Dr Yoshida reported on the activities in IMO, as outlined in document N 904. IMO was moving towards fire safety engineering solutions. Dr Kruppa had been invited to the last meeting of the IMO Fire Protection Sub-committee and had given a presentation on FSE and SC 4. The final draft of a new set of Fire Safety Regulations had been prepared at that meeting and it was hoped that they would be in force by July 2002.

15.4 Society of Fire Protection Engineers (N 905)

The report in document N 905 was noted. Informal discussions between representatives of ISO/TC 92 and SFPE were scheduled for January 2001.

15.5 CEN/TC 127 Fire safety in buildings (N 892)

Prof. Christian gave a brief report on the activities in CEN/TC 127. He noted the earlier comments on the Vienna Agreement and said that it worked well between TC 92/SC 1 and CEN/TC 127. There were no items under the Vienna Agreement with other SCs at present. Prof. Christian further reported that CEN was becoming interested in FSE, although there were no plans to initiate any new work items at this stage. CEN/TC 127 had organised a workshop on FSE for product committees and organisations in liaison, which would be held on 18 October at BSI. The European Commission had invited tenders for a major study on FSE in Member States and the contract would be awarded in October.

15.6 ISO/TC 21 Equipment for fire protection and fire fighting (N 907)

Mr Smithies introduced the report from ISO/TC 21 in document N 907. ISO/TC 21 was still developing its business plan and was in the process of re-organising itself. A new sub-committee on smoke extraction equipment was being established and input from this SC would be of particular importance to ISO/TC 92/SC 4. SC 3 and SC 5 of ISO/TC 21 were establishing working links with the relevant WGs of ISO/TC 92/SC 4. Mr Smithies hoped that TC 21 would be able to provide input to the newly established TG 244 on long term future of fire safety.

The resolutions listed in Annex A were approved.

It was agreed that the next meeting would be held in March 2002 in Australia (subject to confirmation).

The Chairman and members expressed their appreciation to Ms Di Carlo for organising the meetings and for her support during the week.

MAGDALENA DI CARLO

Secretary to ISO/TC 92

MDC/-

ISO/TC 92 re-appoints Prof. Geoff Cox as the Chairman of the TC for a period of three years, ending 2003-09.

ISO/TC 92 thanks Hank Roux for his long and outstanding service to the TC, and in particular as Chairman of SC 3 since 1985 and for leading Groupe des Sages.

ISO/TC 92 agrees to establish a new Task Group (TG 244), with Dr Ron Alpert as convener, with the following task:

To develop further document N 886/Rev 'Framework for the long term future standardisation of fire safety' and prepare proposals for levels 1, 2 and 3 standards.

The task is to be completed by the next meeting of ISO/TC 92.

Sub-committee Chairmen are invited to nominate up to 2 representatives from their SCs by 2000-10-30. Dr Alpert may invite other experts to participate in his TG.

Noting the report from WG 8 in document N 897, ISO/TC 92 approves the proposal to begin preliminary work on an extension of ISO 13943 'Fire safety - Vocabulary' to cover additional fire related terms and definitions.

ISO/TC 92 agrees to disband WG 12, which has completed its main task. ISO/TC 92 thanks Prof. Purser for this work as convener of WG 12.

The Technical Management Board,

noting with satisfaction the results of the ISO/CEN JCG meeting held on 26 September 2000,

approves the following modifications to the current application of the Vienna Agreement, subject to similar approval being given by the CEN Technical Board:

• the number of ISO representatives permitted to attend CEN committee meetings shall be increased up to four, preference to be given to representatives from non-CEN member bodies. Such experts shall continue to represent a consolidated ISO view and ISO committees should consider nominating a head of delegation,
• ISO committees may similarly appoint up to four experts to attend CEN working group meetings - invitation by the CEN parent body is no longer required - again giving preference to representatives from non-CEN members. Such experts should have the status of observers in CEN working groups, but are expected to make effective contributions.
• that the Guidelines be modified to avoid the impression that ISO endorses modifications to ISO standards being adopted by CEN,

recalls that ISO reports of voting and CEN tables of decision are expected to respond explicitly to member body comments;

confirms that for any item to be processed under the Vienna Agreement, it must be an approved work item in both ISO and CEN and both organizations must have agreed on the question of leadership,

further confirms that if an ISO committee has delegated leadership to CEN, it is CEN's responsibility to determine when it is appropriate to issue a draft for enquiry,

invites the TMB Secretariat to proceed, subject to a similar decision within CEN, with a redrafting of the Vienna Agreement and its Guidelines, to constitute a high-level policy/principles of co-operation document, detailed (but simplified) operational procedures, including frequently asked questions and explaining why the Vienna Agreement exists.